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car with no road tax


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#1 OFFLINE   X5WAM

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 06:16 PM

Car with out of date road tax parked in a train station car park spotted when off dutie!What do you do?Call the local stationCall BTPNot bother as your off dutie

#2 OFFLINE   SC James

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 06:23 PM

Car with out of date road tax parked in a train station car park spotted when off dutie!What do you do?Call the local stationCall BTPNot bother as your off dutie


All Police can do is inform DVLA who can chose to prosecute / fine the offender at their discretion.

Being an off duty cop doesn't really come into it, it's not a matter you would report to the Police. Any person can report an untaxed vehicle to DVLA directly.

If you want to know how, A 5 second google returned the following:

____________________________________________

If you see a vehicle on the public road with an out of date tax disc, you can report it online, by telephone or by post. You don't have to give your name. Your report will be investigated and enforcement action taken, if needed.


What you need to report
Provide the details about the vehicle:

  • registration mark
  • make, model and colour
Provide details about the location of the vehicle:

  • eg outside 24 Anystreet, Anytown, Any Postcode
  • any feature landmark eg opposite telephone box
If possible, provide:

  • the time the vehicle can be seen on the public road
  • name and address of the owner
Report the vehicle
Online

Use the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency's (DVLA) online service.

By phone

Telephone the national untaxed vehicles telephone hotline on freephone 0800 0325 202.

By post

Send a letter to the enforcement section at your nearest DVLA local office.

What happens next
An enforcement field officer, who will make a formal sighting of the vehicle and complete a witness statement, will investigate the information you provide and take the appropriate action if needed.

Source: http://www.direct.go...icle/DG_4022073

Reason for edit - Source URL added.

Edited by SC James, 20 February 2009 - 06:33 PM.


#3 OFFLINE   X5WAM

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 06:50 PM

But to go home from station je needs to go on public road. Is there some other reason apart from being skint that the incumbent has no road tax? Insurance, mot etc

#4 OFFLINE   SC James

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 07:02 PM

But to go home from station je needs to go on public road. Is there some other reason apart from being skint that the incumbent has no road tax? Insurance, mot etc


Quite possibly - but in your scenario, you are off duty.

Although you carry your powers/rights of a Constable while off duty, you would only really be expected to act off duty if it was serious enough to warrant doing so.

You'd need to apply some discretion -

In your post, the only fact known is that the car has an expired VEL.

In the scheme of things, (especially while off duty!) all you have is a minor traffic discretion.

If on duty with a radio you could do more checks on the car if desired, but my opinions is that it's not worth of any off duty involvement, other than noting details and informing DVLA as above if you feel that strongly about it.


I know I certainly don't have time to stop and look at everyone's tax disks while I'm going about my daily business :prone:

#5 OFFLINE   X5WAM

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 07:10 PM

Lol

#6 OFFLINE   HOT FUZZ

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 09:44 PM

If I walked past a car and spotted an out of date vel of more than fortnight while off duty I think I would take 5 minutes at home to report it. I pay £35 per year for my tax so why shouldn't others pay their way

#7 OFFLINE   Ewokop

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 10:21 PM

35 a year!

Is that it! Mines near 2 hundred!

#8 OFFLINE   HOT FUZZ

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 10:35 PM

35 a year!

Is that it! Mines near 2 hundred!

So you've got a bigger reason to report untaxed vehicles

#9 OFFLINE   SC James

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 10:44 PM

So you've got a bigger reason to report untaxed vehicles


I am not disputing that reporting to DVLA via the correct means, is the correct thing to do, IF you feel it's appropriate.

I would still question the OP though, regarding informing the Police for further checks, when you spot a car without tax off duty.

Agreed, it does raise the question that if the owner is lacking tax, suspicion is increased wiht regards to what other legal motoring requirements are lacking - but realistically, it's not practical (or appropriate, really) when off duty, to be spotting untaxed cars and running further checks (apart from informing DVLA). Is it? :prone:

#10 OFFLINE   HOT FUZZ

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 10:49 PM

I am not disputing that reporting to DVLA via the correct means, is the correct thing to do, IF you feel it's appropriate.

I would still question the OP though, regarding informing the Police for further checks, when you spot a car without tax off duty.

Agreed, it does raise the question that if the owner is lacking tax, suspicion is increased wiht regards to what other legal motoring requirements are lacking - but realistically, it's not practical (or appropriate, really) when off duty, to be spotting untaxed cars and running further checks (apart from informing DVLA). Is it? :prone:

Depending on individual circumstances I may decide to investigate it further

#11 OFFLINE   Gforceuk

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 11:07 PM

Better things to do with my time to be fair...... if you really are feeling a bit of a power surge when off duty then phone the dvla if you really have to...

Unless your a closet traffic warden who patrols car parks when you cant get on duty :prone: ..

#12 OFFLINE   SBG

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 05:57 AM

Three points

1) The car park is not public highway so no DVLA offence (yes it might have travelled on public road etc) so assuming that the owner has the permission of the car park owner and has completed a SORN then no action.

2) DVLA now send out automatic fines unless a SORN is completed.

3) Assuming that the owner does not have permission from the owner then most car parks make it a condition of entry that you to have an in date tax disc but even then this would be a civil matter.

#13 OFFLINE   foxtrot2008

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 09:20 AM

Car with out of date road tax parked in a train station car park spotted when off dutie!What do you do?Call the local stationCall BTPNot bother as your off dutie


In short not a lot... if it was on the public highway, then it could be removed by the local government if they were so inclined.. but they will only do so once they've determined that it's not SORN

#14 OFFLINE   SNOOZINGPHIL

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 11:34 AM

I really wouldnt bother doing a great deal as as been said all we can do is report it to DVLA. There has been a car ouside one of my shops for nearly 9 weeks with no tax and ive lost count the number of parking attendants and PCSO's that have walked past and not given it a second glance.

#15 OFFLINE   Morse

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 02:28 PM

Car with out of date road tax parked in a train station car park spotted when off dutie!What do you do?Call the local stationCall BTPNot bother as your off dutie



Are you for real - what do you do when you see an expired tax disc off duty?

Railway car park is more than likely not a public road.

#16 OFFLINE   foxtrot2008

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 04:48 PM

Are you for real - what do you do when you see an expired tax disc off duty?

Railway car park is more than likely not a public road.


Now, Now :D its not like he called a SWOT team or anything. Although I warrant you X5WAM does potentially seem a little overly enthusiastic... I've known SC's who give out a VDRS for one bulb :prone: we all have to learn :D

#17 OFFLINE   Aequitas

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 05:54 PM

Are you for real - what do you do when you see an expired tax disc off duty?

Railway car park is more than likely not a public road.


Actually I'd say a Railway car park would be classified as a public road.

Road traffic Act 1988, "Any place to which the public have open access is a public place, even if payment must be made to gain entry."

And...

"A hospital car park used by people visiting the hospital is a public place." - Case law for thought?

Edited by Aequitas, 21 February 2009 - 05:57 PM.


#18 OFFLINE   SC James

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 06:36 PM

I've known SC's who give out a VDRS for one bulb :prone: we all have to learn :D


I'd probably agree that in some cases, words of advice would suffice for one bulb.

But, I guess it depends on the reaction of the driver that's been stopped. If I had any reason to believe they may not change the bulb, then I wouldn't be too worried about using a VDRS. It seems fair enough to me really. My understanding is that VDRS isn't a penalty as such, it just makes them get it fixed within 14 days. And I guess it goes without saying, bulbs are a safety critical component? So - I think in some cases justification for VDRS would be there?

Very slightly off topic - some bulbs on modern cars involve quite a lot of work to change, rather than just nipping to halfrauds and popping one in - which might make some people drive around with blown bulbs for longer than they should...

Happy to stand corrected as I've not done any traffic work yet - but just my 2p's worth :D

#19 OFFLINE   TallGuy

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 07:30 PM

Simple answer, no offence, no action.

I would however make notes but for operational reasons can't say why.

#20 OFFLINE   foxtrot2008

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 08:41 PM

I'd probably agree that in some cases, words of advice would suffice for one bulb.

But, I guess it depends on the reaction of the driver that's been stopped. If I had any reason to believe they may not change the bulb, then I wouldn't be too worried about using a VDRS. It seems fair enough to me really. My understanding is that VDRS isn't a penalty as such, it just makes them get it fixed within 14 days. And I guess it goes without saying, bulbs are a safety critical component? So - I think in some cases justification for VDRS would be there?

Very slightly off topic - some bulbs on modern cars involve quite a lot of work to change, rather than just nipping to halfrauds and popping one in - which might make some people drive around with blown bulbs for longer than they should...

Happy to stand corrected as I've not done any traffic work yet - but just my 2p's worth :D


It's a question of proportionality.... You're right a VDRS is not a penalty as such but have to ask yourself what the cost of complying with a VDRS vs. a fixed penalty ticket for the same offence? In order to comply with the VDRS you're going to need to get the ticket stamped by an MOT Garage, the cost of this is more than likely to be more the the equivilent FPN for a single offence.

As for the reaction issue, one would assume that you were told about the 'attitude test' whilst in training :)

If the vehicle has other lamps that will clarify it's position, then if appropriate, these may in the short term might well be used in place of the bulb that has blown. You're right it is a lot of effort to swap bulbs on some newer cars... but that's not really our problem.

Anyhow, 9 time out of 10 if there's one bulb gone there will be others, the lights the illuminate the number plate are always worth a look :prone:

#21 OFFLINE   Headset57

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Posted 22 February 2009 - 01:13 AM

Actually I'd say a Railway car park would be classified as a public road.

Road traffic Act 1988, "Any place to which the public have open access is a public place, even if payment must be made to gain entry."

And...

"A hospital car park used by people visiting the hospital is a public place." - Case law for thought?



However, it's only a public place when the station is 'open' for business; ie, first and last trains.


http://dvla.gov.uk/o...sed.aspx?ext=dg

Edited by Headset 57, 22 February 2009 - 01:20 AM.


#22 OFFLINE   Morse

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Posted 22 February 2009 - 02:51 AM

A railway car park is a public road but it still doesnt matter a jot if the VEL is expired. You cannot enfore this offence. It is not maintained by a roads authority.

#23 OFFLINE   Aequitas

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Posted 22 February 2009 - 09:44 AM

A railway car park is a public road but it still doesnt matter a jot if the VEL is expired. You cannot enfore this offence. It is not maintained by a roads authority.


Correct. "The term 'public road' in the Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994 means a road repairable at public expense." Have to admit I got slightly confused with so many different acts using different definitions!

Edited by Aequitas, 22 February 2009 - 12:16 PM.


#24 OFFLINE   SkinSte

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Posted 23 February 2009 - 12:58 PM

As a MoP, I've reported cars to the DVLA before for being untaxed. All I do is take a snap on my mobile and then spend 2 minutes filling in the online form next time I'm bored at work. I pay my road tax, I don't see why anyone else* shouldn't.

#25 OFFLINE   HOT FUZZ

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Posted 23 February 2009 - 01:29 PM

It's a question of proportionality.... You're right a VDRS is not a penalty as such but have to ask yourself what the cost of complying with a VDRS vs. a fixed penalty ticket for the same offence? In order to comply with the VDRS you're going to need to get the ticket stamped by an MOT Garage, the cost of this is more than likely to be more the the equivilent FPN for a single offence.

As for the reaction issue, one would assume that you were told about the 'attitude test' whilst in training :D

If the vehicle has other lamps that will clarify it's position, then if appropriate, these may in the short term might well be used in place of the bulb that has blown. You're right it is a lot of effort to swap bulbs on some newer cars... but that's not really our problem.

Anyhow, 9 time out of 10 if there's one bulb gone there will be others, the lights the illuminate the number plate are always worth a look :prone:

Depending on which bulb, time of day and other defects on the vehicle depends on what the driver is issued with. And yes I will give a vdrs for one bulb out




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