52 replies to this topic

[Burnsy2023]

We're also a disciplined service.

Bonding is one thing, but it's my experience that any team works better with that hierarchy and without over-familiarity.

Well I suppose I have to just disagree there. I don't respond well in teams where a person feels they need to stamp their authority.

When a senior officer needs to lay down the law, who's going to take him seriously?

Mutual respect means that I would always listen and respond to what a skipper or other senior officer says.

[The sleeping Policeman]

To me Mate or Pal is just rude and a very quick way to a short conversation. I think with the regular officers it's their rank Guv or Sarge minimum and Sir / Ma'am to a Ch Insp or above.

For MSC I think it depends on location and who is there. even after 17 years as a Inspector I still look around when someone says Sir LoL

[rolex-oyster]

For MSC I think it depends on location and who is there. even after 17 years as a Inspector I still look around when someone says Sir LoL

Hi are you a regular Inspector?
If not what would you expect to be addressed as by the regulars?

Since the announcment of Winsor 2 and the realisation that HMG considers us lower than a snakes belly things have started to subtly change.Far less fore lock tugging the words sarge and ma'am/sir are heard far less.The previously disguised contempt for some of the senior ranks is no longer veiled.Alot of the stupid ideas dreamed up to accelerate promotion are not now being done.The world has changed alot amongst alot ( certainly over 5 years service) of regulars and we have had enough of all the BS.

[The sleeping Policeman]

Hi are you a regular Inspector?
If not what would you expect to be addressed as by the regulars?

Since the announcment of Winsor 2 and the realisation that HMG considers us lower than a snakes belly things have started to subtly change.Far less fore lock tugging the words sarge and ma'am/sir are heard far less.The previously disguised contempt for some of the senior ranks is no longer veiled.Alot of the stupid ideas dreamed up to accelerate promotion are not now being done.The world has changed alot amongst alot ( certainly over 5 years service) of regulars and we have had enough of all the BS.

As it says no I am not a regular Inspector nor do I like the title Inspector MSC hence why I always look around when someone says "Sir". The whole title and badges of rank is a strange beast and when we had our own titles I think it was better but thats a different discussion.

Most regular officers call me by my first name and if a new probationor does call me Sir I thank them and the ask them to call me by my first name.

[rolex-oyster]

Ok thanks.
Our specials don't have ranks that match the regs in any shape or form.Its section officer or senior section officer so interesting to learn!

[Chewie]

We don't have superior officers, only senior ones!

I don't know why people make that distinction.

I would always listen and respond to what a skipper or other senior officer says.

Shouldn't that be superior?!

[Cuddles]

My recent acting stint taught me that I absolutely detest being called "sarge". I would much rather be called by my first name/nickname, though maybe it's simply because it was a bit 'new' for me.

Personally (when in PC mode) I call most sergeants by their first name unless I don't know/like them, most inspectors/chief inspectors get called "boss" (though I do call some inspectors by their first name when the situation allows) and anyone more senior is sir/ma'am. We seem to have quite a relaxed approach in my force, though everyone uses the 'correct' terminology when appropriate.

[Burnsy2023]

Shouldn't that be superior?!

It doesn't matter, I don't make any distinction between the two

[Bart S]

Shouldn't that be superior?!

Nobody is "superior" to me, they may hold a higher grade or rank than me, so that makes them "senior" to me. Superior is antiquated and harks back to the days of doffing your cap to the landed gentry.

[Burnsy2023]

Nobody is "superior" to me, they may hold a higher grade or rank than me, so that makes them "senior" to me. Superior is antiquated and harks back to the days of doffing your cap to the landed gentry.

No, it makes them superior:

http://oxforddiction...rior?q=superior

[Bart S]

Like I said, no-one is superior to me. Just because they have a rank doesn't make them any better than me.

[Burnsy2023]

Like I said, no-one is superior to me. Just because they have a rank doesn't make them any better than me.

Anyone of higher rank to you is superior to you by definition.

Edited by Burnsy2023, 06 August 2012 - 10:32 AM.

[rolex-oyster]

I know alot of female police officers both serving and having left the service of say 8 years plus service who have utter contempt for the Alpha male types of supervisors (including female alphas).The reason is the sheer crass and illegal way they try and mess them around with their duties and expect them to fit in with what ever silly whim/stupid idea the pole climbers wanted to do.
It is actually amusing to watch such an exchange when a supervisor tries to impose overtime where child care is an issue.
We are in the dark ages around looking after our employees unless they have 9-5 regular hours and a rank.The 24/7 PCs get dumped on again and again no wonder we cannot retain female staff.Then they expect us to bow and curtsey... yeah right!

[Bart S]

Anyone of higher rank to you is superior to you by definition.

In reality, they're no better than me.

[Burnsy2023]

In reality, they're no better than me.

Depends what you mean by better. Are skippers more experienced at their job and are likely to be able to handle more jobs than me? Yes. Do I have a problem with that? No, I don't have an inferiority complex

Anyway, superiority isn't necessarily about being "better" than you.

Edited by Burnsy2023, 06 August 2012 - 10:56 AM.

[Owen]

I think this thread is going way off topic!

I personally shall be calling S/Insp + S/CI by Sir or Ma'am, like reg ranks until told otherwise!

[Bart S]

Depends what you mean by better. Are skippers more experienced at their job and are likely to be able to handle more jobs than me? Yes. Do I have a problem with that? No, I don't have an inferiority complex

Anyway, superiority isn't necessarily about being "better" than you.

I don't have an inferiority complex, some of my managers started in the job after me and don't have my "on road" experience. Therefore they are not superior to me.

I think this thread is going way off topic!

I personally shall be calling S/Insp + S/CI by Sir or Ma'am, like reg ranks until told otherwise!

It's still on topic, we're talking about senior ranks.

[Owen]

I don't have an inferiority complex, some of my managers started in the job after me and don't have my "on road" experience. Therefore they are not superior to me.



It's still on topic, we're talking about senior ranks.

The thread is about how you would greet officers, not whether they are senior or superior.

[Bart S]

Thankfully we don't have officers only higher grades.

[Owen]

Thankfully we don't have officers only higher grades.

I was referring to the term as general 'Police Officers'

[David]

My recent acting stint taught me that I absolutely detest being called "sarge". I would much rather be called by my first name/nickname, though maybe it's simply because it was a bit 'new' for me.

Mm that's your choice, my argument is, and remains, that if I or anyone were to meet you for the first time and saw your stripes, you should be addressed as 'sarge'/'sergeant' until you invite them to address you otherwise. 'Ah please call me Cuddles, unless we are talking to MoP...'

[Cuddles]

Mm that's your choice, my argument is, and remains, that if I or anyone were to meet you for the first time and saw your stripes, you should be addressed as 'sarge'/'sergeant' until you invite them to address you otherwise. 'Ah please call me Cuddles, unless we are talking to MoP...'

Oh yes, I accept that and I'm sure that it goes without saying that everyone has been calling me 'sarge' until told otherwise. To be honest I think I was just a bit 'weirded-out' by it...

[IndiaTango]

Even though I'm only a volunteer, I'll generally call everyone 'Sir' other volunteers of my age don't agree with me and go by first names. Then again, I'm young, so I tend to call everyone 'Sir' on the phone and via emails. Just the way I was brought up, I suppose!

Though today I walked past a Superintendent who said hello to me and I almost, nearly blanked him and walked by. No idea where my mind had gone. I quickly managed a 'Hello Sir' and promptly left.

[fruitandveg]

My recent acting stint taught me that I absolutely detest being called "sarge". I would much rather be called by my first name/nickname, though maybe it's simply because it was a bit 'new' for me.

Personally (when in PC mode) I call most sergeants by their first name unless I don't know/like them, most inspectors/chief inspectors get called "boss" (though I do call some inspectors by their first name when the situation allows) and anyone more senior is sir/ma'am. We seem to have quite a relaxed approach in my force, though everyone uses the 'correct' terminology when appropriate.

There's a fair few middle management I've met who want you to refer to them by first name, citing the same reasons. I think it's signs of organisational change more than anything. I used to do temp office work for a big food company in my area who supply many large retailers and who also have a large local agricultural operation. Now when it was a standalone company, the people who ran it were old school landed gentry with the local peasants as labour. Lots of old timers there said it was expected to refer to "Mr Jones, Mr Smith etc...", as if the feudal system had never passed! When a big American company took them over in the 1980s, they swept this old management structure away and insisted on everyone, from top to bottom, being referred to by their first name. Not saying this is right or wrong, but it is explanatory.

I too refer to inspectors and chief inspectors as "boss" in both special and staff roles. Mind you, I've also noticed a lot of police staff will refer to police officers of any rank by their names.

[Chewie]

Nobody is "superior" to me, they may hold a higher grade or rank than me, so that makes them "senior" to me. Superior is antiquated and harks back to the days of doffing your cap to the landed gentry.

You've missed the point entirely... read the whole thread, you'll see I was taking the mickey!