18 replies to this topic

[jackisback]

Hello all,
I'm thinking of applying to be a Regular ('Though not for a while, as I'm not old enough yet).
Could anyone explain the HPDS to me?
I'm particularly interested in what I would have to do to be selected, if having a degree would help or hinder me, etc.
Regards,
Jackisback

[Hades]

Having a degree wont in itself make any difference.

All the information you should need is here http://www.npia.police.uk/hpds

[Viper_Cop]

To be honest, they seem to change things so much that I wouldn't make any decision based on what the police does now - in 2 years it'll have all changed. All I'll say, is that a degree can never be a bad thing and at the moment it's going to give you "one more string in your bow", so go for it. Then if you have to wait for recruitment to open up, at least you've got something to fall back on.

[jackisback]

Having a degree wont in itself make any difference.

All the information you should need is here http://www.npia.police.uk/hpds

Thanks for the link.

To be honest, they seem to change things so much that I wouldn't make any decision based on what the police does now - in 2 years it'll have all changed. All I'll say, is that a degree can never be a bad thing and at the moment it's going to give you "one more string in your bow", so go for it. Then if you have to wait for recruitment to open up, at least you've got something to fall back on.

Great advice, thanks.

[Million]

a degree can never be a bad thing and at the moment it's going to give you "one more string in your bow", so go for it.

There are many a daily mail reader that would disagree with you there, apparently they're not worth the paper they're written on anymore.

Makes me wonder why I'm sat here in the library reading about 'behaviourally mediated trophic cascades', when I could be out working in tescos for my benefits.

[Machiavelli]

There are many a daily mail reader that would disagree with you there, apparently they're not worth the paper they're written on anymore.

They would disagree that a degree in itself can never be a bad thing? Then I would suggest they're idiots.

Debt, sure it's a bitch if you're not going to get a high paid job at the end, and that alone can and probably should influence the decision, but I would never suggest higher education could be detrimental to anything other than your finances.

[GodAtum]

I'm curious as to the timeframes. How long on average would it take to make Sgt and then Inspector?

[bensonby]

I'm curious as to the timeframes. How long on average would it take to make Sgt and then Inspector?

There is no guarantees that you will reach various ranks at all. what the scheme does is support you, give you the opportunities to develop yourself and give you experience.

You still have to complete two years probation as a constable. You take the OSPRE exams and once you pass the selection to the next rank you are automatically promoted rather than having to wait for a vacancy - so you would expect faster promotion than normal.

[Nelson]

Certainly the expectation in Scotland is that you pass the promotion exams/diploma at the first opportunity, then you get promoted once passed. If you fail at any stage, you're off. They say promotion to CI can be achieved in around 6-7 years.

That said, statistically, there's only roughly 0.02% of Scottish officers on the scheme. I wouldn't have thought it would be vastly different down south.

Edited by Nelson, 30 March 2012 - 06:15 PM.

[Fenix]

There is no guarantees that you will reach various ranks at all. what the scheme does is support you, give you the opportunities to develop yourself and give you experience.

You still have to complete two years probation as a constable. You take the OSPRE exams and once you pass the selection to the next rank you are automatically promoted rather than having to wait for a vacancy - so you would expect faster promotion than normal.

Out of interest do you know what kind of jobs people get promoted in to on HPDS..... is it all office based i.e. stop and search policy or some other equally dull role at ESB ?? Or do you actually get put in to the cut and thrust of policing still?

[LoneRanger]

Out of interest do you know what kind of jobs people get promoted in to on HPDS..... is it all office based i.e. stop and search policy or some other equally dull role at ESB ?? Or do you actually get put in to the cut and thrust of policing still?

Most of the HPDS officers in my force are deployed in a strategic capacity. There is a HPDS Sergeant on response and a DCI deployed on the CID! I have a Degree, PGCE and i'm currently finishing off my Masters in Leadership & Management but doesn't mean i will get through the HPDS if i applied! I joined the normal route and can always look at applying for the HPDS Selection process, whilst it's still in existence anyway! My only other observation is that HPDS is VERY difficult to get on as you have to be sponsored by your ACPO team and after that you still have to run the gauntlet of the process itself!

To put it into context my force only supported 1 officer for the 2011 HPDS cohort!

[Übèrnamè]

There are many a daily mail reader that would disagree with you there, apparently they're not worth the paper they're written on anymore.

Sure, if you do sociology don't expect people to respect it as a full time degree. (Trust me, I did it at A-level and it's not a full subject, more of a bread and butter subject to go with a proper science).

There are a large variety of more worthy degrees that are as easily attainable.

[Gavin]

I'm curious as to the timeframes. How long on average would it take to make Sgt and then Inspector?

I was told when I expressed an interest that they would expect you (if you join as the sceme as a Pc) to be an Inspector by the end of the 5 years.

[Rob90]

Sure, if you do sociology don't expect people to respect it as a full time degree. (Trust me, I did it at A-level and it's not a full subject, more of a bread and butter subject to go with a proper science).

There are a large variety of more worthy degrees that are as easily attainable.

You've done A-Level sociology so you are qualified to say that sociology is not a proper subject? Oh dear...

I would contend that, whilst it may not be 'useful' in a wide variety of jobs, sociology is very much a proper subject, and I for one found that studying it at A-Level gave me a far better understanding of society than I previously had. I wholeheartedly agree that there are a huge number of 'soft' degree subjects out there, that arguably should not be degrees, however I would not agree that sociology is one of them. In order to study an essay based subject such as sociology you have to develop a wide range of skills which are eminently transferable. I am studying law, because I want to do something for which a law degree is required, however even if I were not to go into the law as a career, I know even at the end of my second year that I have developed numerous skills relating to research, writing, forming arguments and advocacy that will be very useful to me in whatever career I should pursue.

[Übèrnamè]

If you honestly believe sociology is not an easy/soft touch subject I personally think you either done it and feel you need to justify it or you have no idea what the subject entails.

It's a complimentary subject, like media/films studies, and is nowhere near a degree in psychology, English, engineering or science degrees.

Yes, surprisingly yes, after doing the course for two years and getting a healthy B in it, I can have an opinion on the matter.

Just for the record, I loved sociology and it's easily one of my favourite subjects, as long as politics and law. I just don't hold it in high regard to subjects such as above.

[Rob90]

If you honestly believe sociology is not an easy/soft touch subject I personally think you either done it and feel you need to justify it or you have no idea what the subject entails.

It's a complimentary subject, like media/films studies, and is nowhere near a degree in psychology, English, engineering or science degrees.

Yes, surprisingly yes, after doing the course for two years and getting a healthy B in it, I can have an opinion on the matter.

Just for the record, I loved sociology and it's easily one of my favourite subjects, as long as politics and law. I just don't hold it in high regard to subjects such as above.

That is your view, and you are entitled to it. Please do not presume to know anything about me, my academic credentials, or my knowledge of subjects about which I speak. I too studied sociology to A-Level, and like you I got a B (FYI, if your teacher tells you that a topic never comes up in an exam, and that therefore you really needn't bother revising it, take that information with a barrel of salt). I am now in my second year of studying law at a good university, so I have no need to justify to you, or to anyone else, my choices of A-level subject.

My question in response to your point is, how do you know what it is to study sociology at undergraduate level (as you comment on the difficulty of a degree in it), if you have only studied it at A-Level?

Sociology is, I would argue, at least as valid a social science as Psychology, and at least as valid a degree, and should not be compared to media studies, which I too do tend to deride (although I have no right to, as all I know about it is what I overhear in the university library). Sociology is, or rather can be, scientifically and academically rigorous, in the same way that history or law can be.
Do I think that sociology is as 'difficult' as law? No, but that is, I would argue, more related to the constraints of the subject matter, rather than the academic rigour, or lack thereof, of the discipline itself.

With that, I think that perhaps we should get back to the topic in hand. I am more than happy to continue a discussion of the academic merits of various subjects in a separate thread if someone wishes to split that thread from this.

Edited by Rob90, 03 April 2012 - 05:35 PM.

[Hades]

There was me thinking this was a thread about HPDS, not the value or lack thereof of degrees and A Levels in various subjects....

[CmdKeen]

(Scotland post warning...)
I know "older" cops who have applied whilst already in the job and with a few years as a Sgt under them. One got on the scheme and went up to Inspector straight away, one narrowly failed on one of the tests but got an acting Inspector job pretty much straight away as well. For those who are already officers the HPDS can serve as a good way to actually get opportunities you may not if you're just applying for them. You obviously have to meet the criteria but it makes the force consider your long term development (i.e. what does this person need to do for us to consider them well rounded for senior ranks).

Career management isn't really done outwith the HPDS, you have your current job and apply for new ones with the organisation not considering long term planning in its application of who goes where. I know comparisons with the armed forces attract the usual comments (or the world of business) but it is something they are far, far better at. The HR department should be able to know who wants, and who the force thinks is capable, of going all the way, what their career plan is, what posts they should be filling to get there, and when and where the vacancies are likely to arise that raise those.

[brimstone]

Out of interest do you know what kind of jobs people get promoted in to on HPDS..... is it all office based i.e. stop and search policy or some other equally dull role at ESB ?? Or do you actually get put in to the cut and thrust of policing still?

I know of one who is a response sgt; another is a type of partnership inspector.