16 replies to this topic

[Llama]

Two topics in a day... wow!

As I understand it from discussions with specials in West Dorset, there has never been a parallel ranking system of Special Sgt, Special Insp etc here in Dorset, and instead we've always had the Divisional Officer / Area Officer here.

My question is - what do you all think of that? Would you rather the same ranking as the regs?
The reason I ask is that you know somebody called Sergeant is important, but Divisional Officer? It doesn't quite have the same meaning.

Would you, in CC Baker's position, change the titles or do you like them the way it is?

[Derf]

If it aint broke...

the rank structure in the specials is mainly for admin, development and point of contact purposes. I'm guessing they'll be some confusion from MoP's if officers were referred to as 'Special Sergeant'.

I have never signed any statement etc as DSO xyz (unless countersigning expenses). it's Always SC xyz.

Edited by Derf, 30 June 2011 - 05:10 PM.

[Llama]

If it aint broke...

the rank structure in the specials is mainly for admin, development and point of contact purposes. I'm guessing they'll be some confusion from MoP's if officers were referred to as 'Special Sergeant'.

I have never signed any statement etc as DSO xyz (unless countersigning expenses). it's Always SC xyz.

A very good point - titles like special inspector may be misleading... Though it would make you higher rank lot sound more important to MoP's!

[Chewie]

I have never signed any statement etc as DSO xyz (unless countersigning expenses). it's Always SC xyz.

On statements, I always put "I am Deputy Section Officer Chewie based at Mos Eisley Police Station..." but put Special Constable in the 'Occupation' section at the top of the MG11. I never used to, but when paperwork continuously came to me addressed as DSO Chewie, I thought I might as well - it's what I am, after all!

Personally, I'd rather be referred to as a DSO rather than Special Sergeant though - as you say, it saves any confusion with the public - although if Dorset changed the titles at some point in the future it wouldn't bother me in the slightest (although there was some confusion, as a few people thought I'd been demoted when they changed the titles from SO to DSO!)

[Llama]

On statements, I always put "I am Deputy Section Officer Chewie based at Mos Eisley Police Station..." but put Special Constable in the 'Occupation' section at the top of the MG11. I never used to, but when paperwork continuously came to me addressed as DSO Chewie, I thought I might as well - it's what I am, after all!

Personally, I'd rather be referred to as a DSO rather than Special Sergeant though - as you say, it saves any confusion with the public - although if Dorset changed the titles at some point in the future it wouldn't bother me in the slightest (although there was some confusion, as a few people thought I'd been demoted when they changed the titles from SO to DSO!)

Haha - I suppose it doesn't really make any odds, just I know there are officers who don't fully understand what all the special rank titles actually mean!

[Chewie]

Haha - I suppose it doesn't really make any odds, just I know there are officers who don't fully understand what all the special rank titles actually mean!

I assume you mean regular officers, as opposed to other Specials? I'd hope that all Specials know what our titles mean. As for regs, well, they don't really need to know what's what on a general day-to-day basis - it's an administrative title within the Special Constabulary more than anything, with a few exceptions (Specials only ops, for example), the title's not really important for operational policing (although some Specials would like to think otherwise!)

Edited by Chewie, 30 June 2011 - 08:37 PM.

[Llama]

I assume you mean regular officers, as opposed to other Specials? I'd hope that all Specials know what our titles mean. As for regs, well, they don't really need to know what's what on a general day-to-day basis - it's an administrative title within the Special Constabulary more than anything, with a few exceptions (Specials only ops, for example) the title's not really important for operational policing (although some Specials would like to think otherwise!)

One of them was a special! Made me laugh a fair bit!

I suppose it doesn't really make any odds, you just have to know who the king of the specials in the station is and otherwise titles don't really come into play except for the nice bars on your shoulder!

[Chewie]

One of them was a special! Made me laugh a fair bit!

In that case, I'd say it was a failing on their part... if only as far as getting expenses forms signed off!

I suppose it doesn't really make any odds, you just have to know who the king of the specials in the station is...

Ah, now you've hit the nail on the head there... some Specials know more than others, are more capable than others, are more hard-working than others, and more willing to help others - they're the ones to keep your eye on, whether they've got bling on their shoulders or not!

[Llama]

In that case, I'd say it was a failing on their part... if only as far as getting expenses forms signed off!



Ah, now you've hit the nail on the head there... some Specials know more than others, are more capable than others, are more hard-working than others, and more willing to help others - they're the ones to keep your eye on, whether they've got bling on their shoulders or not!

Yeah - a truly good special will be "good" at what they do regardless of what title they have. That's the kind of special I hope to be!

I'm counting down the days...

[TallGuy]

Yeah - a truly good special will be "good" at what they do regardless of what title they have. That's the kind of special I hope to be!

I'm counting down the days...

Indeed. I am a force lead in a particular area of operations but do I have an (official) title to reflect that - no I don't. And if I did it would be for organisational purposes only.

With regard to SC or regs not knowing what the other does and what the SC grades mean, that is down to the SC not paying attention as it is explained during training and there should be organisational rank family trees scattered around the stations. Admittedly the one on SharePoint is wrong but I'm trying to fix that. The SC Handbook, which I'm working on will hopefully be "published" soon and should answer a lot of questions from all sides about how SC are recruited, trained and deployed.

[Llama]

Indeed. I am a force lead in a particular area of operations but do I have an (official) title to reflect that - no I don't. And if I did it would be for organisational purposes only.

With regard to SC or regs not knowing what the other does and what the SC grades mean, that is down to the SC not paying attention as it is explained during training and there should be organisational rank family trees scattered around the stations. Admittedly the one on SharePoint is wrong but I'm trying to fix that. The SC Handbook, which I'm working on will hopefully be "published" soon and should answer a lot of questions from all sides about how SC are recruited, trained and deployed.

Haha fair enough - TallGuy to you know if we need to print off the workbooks and bring them with us to training, or are we given hard copies when we get there?

[Derf]

The SC Handbook, which I'm working on will hopefully be "published" soon

Is there a chapter on 'cakable' offences?

[Llama]

Is there a chapter on 'cakable' offences?

How about an about the author section with an artsy black and white posey picture?

[TallGuy]

Haha fair enough - TallGuy to you know if we need to print off the workbooks and bring them with us to training, or are we given hard copies when we get there?

You don't need to print anything off as we do not expect you to have access to printers. Anything you need hard-copy will be provided at the forces expense. The only reason you have the training material in soft-copy format is ease and cost of supply and use.

Is there a chapter on 'cakable' offences?

Indeed, though there is some debate over the charging scale. Level 1 being a giant bag of M&M's, through level 5 being a chocolate cake of not less than 12" diameter and 3" high.

How about an about the author section with an artsy black and white posey picture?

Hmmm, I am the author, but to say it was all my own work would be wholly untrue as the baseline was obtained from another force, although the final product bares little resemblance to it.

[Llama]

You don't need to print anything off as we do not expect you to have access to printers. Anything you need hard-copy will be provided at the forces expense. The only reason you have the training material in soft-copy format is ease and cost of supply and use.

That's good to know! On last check the training package was upwards of 1500 pages - That's almost a whole toner cartridge!

Indeed, though there is some debate over the charging scale. Level 1 being a giant bag of M&M's, through level 5 being a chocolate cake of not less than 12" diameter and 3" high.

I knew there was a reason I joined!

Hmmm, I am the author, but to say it was all my own work would be wholly untrue as the baseline was obtained from another force, although the final product bares little resemblance to it.

As long as you cite your research sources there should be no issue there! I look forward to coming across it in the near future! Are you coming to any of our training days then?
Apparently uniform fitting is before the PS training. I look forward to emitting the characteristic stabbie sigh! I always wondered why officers seemed to sigh a lot!

[Derf]

where does fizzy haribo (other sweet confectionary manufacturers are available) on the scale/

[REG9]

Haha - I suppose it doesn't really make any odds, just I know there are officers who don't fully understand what all the special rank titles actually mean!

Good point!!!!!

I always address everyone as Sir or maam, you can't go wrong!!!!!!!!!